“Lazy” learners how long did it take you to reach fluency?

42 comments

1. That’s not lazy, I’ve been “studying” for 10 years and I’m probably barely N4.

2. Tl;dr Are we ever really fluent?

   I might be as lazy as it gets.

   * Lived there twenty years ago for about a year.
   * Practiced journal writing upon my return to Australia for a few years.
   * I loved the Dictionary of Basic Japanese Grammar.
   * Only in the past month have been using Kanji Study and Anki.
   * I also recently bought The Wild Robot in Japanese (野生のロボット) to practice reading.

   Fluency? That might have to be defined. I can’t read a newspaper. I could speak within 3 months of living there without needing a dictionary often, and after 6 months I was much faster. I could (and I guess I still can) do live interpretation between Japanese and English speakers.

   My grammar was terrible until I started journalling. That was a wake-up call. (The DoBJG is awesome for that.)

   Interestingly, 野生のロボット has plenty of words I’ve never learned, as well as compound words that are so simple and yet I never encountered them before. I love it, and feel like it’s adding to my fluency.

3. I hope nobody feels like they’re lazy because they don’t study for two hours a day or live in Japan. It’s alright to not have as accelerated progress as that one YouTuber guy who learned it all in three months. That’s insane, the good kind of insane, but it’s also good to keep in mind that we’re not racing with each other to get fluent. I am far from fluent, so I can’t answer your question.

4. I would describe my pace as more or less steady for the last 4-5 years… The first 2 years was a bit inconsistent…just doing Anki as a daily habit, some grammar learning and memorizing.

   Then I upped it to about 1 – 1.5 hours a day, for more or less the last 2+ years. Quite happy with where I’m at now – being able to read bunkobons with relative ease (more dialogue, less murakami-type which is still difficult); can generally carry on conversations (though making grammar mistakes still); can catch simple conversations in tv dramas though still need subtitles.

   Definitely not fluent but it’s nice to be able to reach a level of communication 🙂

5. This is a journey measured in hours, not years. If it takes 1500 hours to get good, then that could take however many years depending on the person.

   I myself started this journey 6 years ago, but I would say I have around 1000-1200 hours. Some years I only did 30 mins a day most months, other years I did 2-3 hours a day.

   Honestly I attribute SRS memorization more than anything to my success in comprehension lol

6. Don’t worry I’ve been “studying” on and off for like what 8 years, and I’m just barely n4-early n3. I usually wouldn’t study at all during the school years. I started doing some WaniKani when I was overseas for fun about 6ish years ago. Since then I did wanikani for a bit but nothing else. I really started seriously studying the past couple months and since then I went from a rough n5 to where I am now. It’s not a marathon and we often have things in life that take over the hobby

7. I’ve been studying on and off for 3 years now, 2 of those being in college courses where, admittedly, I was pretty lazy. But now that I’ve been on my own studying I find myself working at a bit of a better pace. If I’m not feeling well, I take a break. I read with a kanji plugin, copy down new words and practice my listening via songs, tv shows and casual conversations. I’m proud of any small steps I make, and even just vaguely recognizing a kanji or a phrase makes me smile each time 🙂 Here’s to more lazy studying!

8. You’re not lazy. This sub frequently forgets that people often have other obligations and heck even other disciplines to learn often at the same time as learning Japanese.

   Unless you’re young and have lots of free time, it’s uncommon to find a period in your life to dedicate yourself to *specifically* learn Japanese and all the hours it’s hungry for.

   I myself am learning other skills as well as Japanese.

9. I started studying almost 15 years ago. Did 2 years in University in my home country where I got to the bottom rung of N3, went to live in Japan on an exchange program for a year where I got to the upper rungs of N3, in the 10 years since I lived there my conversational skills (listening, tones, breadth of topics, etc.) has increased at a glacial pace but is at N2 while my Kanji skills and reading/writing skills have gone down to probably N4 or even N5.

   Kanji’s hard… but I don’t really need reading or writing, I just like being able to have a conversation with people and so that’s what I’ve prioritized. In my current line of work I meet a fair number of Japanese people and haven’t struggled to communicate at all, but even a lot of the basic Kanji have started to fade from my memory. Honourifics beyond the -masu/desu form have also begun to fade, but how often will I need to say meshiagaru?

10. When I first started, I picked up duolingo. I set my goal to 15 minutes a day and did that consistently for a few months. I was so proud of myself! I’ve never done anything with that much consistency, let alone study for the fun of it.

    Then I read that it takes 2k-4k hours to reach n1 level. Okay, that shouldn’t be too bad… so I plugged it into a calculator and found out it would take me a minimum of 20 years to get there 🙃

    All that to say, I’ve been doing about an hour a day, and that feels sustainable to me now. I track my hours pretty diligently, so I don’t lie to myself about my progress. Maybe you can do a similar calculation to get an idea of how long it might take you?

    Also following cause I’d love to hear some success stories.

11. It took me about 6 years to be fluent in English without much formal training. I started learning basic Japanese grammar and have been passively listening to the lessons on Spotify about 1hr a day for the past 7-8 months. At this rate, I think I can be conversational in about 4 years. Not fluent though.

12. I’ve been studying japanese on and off since i was 16… I’ll hit the 20 year mark in March 🤣🤣, i’ll let you know if i hit fluency by then

    Edit: i can maybe pass n5…maybe

13. I believe I’m about the same level you are. I’ve also been self teaching for about 3 years now with days in between practices. I just got back from a Japan trip and I gotta say I didn’t struggle nearly as much as I thought I would

    I struggled talking to native Japanese speakers don’t get me wrong but I was able to pick up simple sentences fairly easily and i could pick up words in more complex sentences. Also as far as I can tell what I was saying in Japanese they could understand. I got a few compliments on my Japanese as well

    Overall I felt really proud with how far I’ve gotten myself but it also encouraged me to try and do more. I had a lot of fun using what I taught myself and seeing that they understood and even responded right away in Japanese. All this to say, I still don’t consider myself fluent by any means but being able to see what I’ve been lazily practicing was very encouraging

14. The goal here is you reach a stage where you can “study” by just reading stuff you want to read or watching stuff you want to watch or whatever.

15. I started watching anime when I was 14. I was a shut in(basically hikki) for three years and during that period, I did nothing but watch anime and play games(mostly English games like Maplestory because I couldn’t read Japanese back then). I only learned kana when I was 17. After I learned kana, I bought a Pokemon movie manga from Kinokuniya and discovered that I could somehow read and understand Japanese through furigana. I went from there to purchasing more manga(of anime that I’ve watched) with furigana. I’m now 33, but throughout the years, I’ve not touched a single textbook on Japanese. I didn’t watch as much anime as I did back then, but I have since progressed to manga, then to light novels which I read everyday now. Also there was a period of time where I was hooked on Japanese radio(anime, normal) and had extended periods of time at work(I could have earphones on during work) where I basically listened to radio all day long. In terms of fluency, I have had Japanese natives mistake me for a Japanese(in both text and voice chats), and I’ve been used as the standard for the issuing of a Japanese fluency tag on a particular discord server I was in.

    TLDR, it took me about 17 years, give or take, to reach fluency.

16. I’m like in between N4 and N3. I’m going to take the N3 in a few weeks, but my chances of passing are dubious at best lol.

    I came to Japan about 3 years ago, got up to about an N4 over 2 years of light study, and this year decided I wanted to study more seriously and take the exam. Unfortunatey some procrastination happened over summer around June-November after going on some trips and work ramping up a lot, so I barely studied at all in that period. But now I probably put an average of 2 hours a day into SRS, an hour or so into doing grammar drills and watch some Japanese youtube or read manga if I feel like it (sometimes I don’t do it at all, sometimes for about 1-1 1/2 hours) So roughly 3 – 4 hours per day studying is my norm to reach where I am now, but I lost a lot of progress when I stopped studying for those 4 months.

17. Started N3 after 2 years of study. I was pretty lazy and passive only intensely studying for the first 3-5 months.

    Now that I have the basics I just watch Tv, occasional Youtube, and add vocabulary and grammar to flashcards when I see new stuff.

    I’m a little behind on Kanji but that’s only because I do no reading.

    Considering I spent $2 on learning Japanese, I think I made great progress.

18. I got to N3 within 2 years but haven’t really been studying for a whole year since, mostly just playing games and reading books (finished Journey to the West in japanese recently). I’m not really fluent but I’ve been using the language everyday purely because I enjoy playing games using it.

    Is this even lazy? I don’t really think so, I would’ve probably burned out and given up if I was actually studying nonstop without getting to just have fun.

19. I’m pretty diligent with putting spare time toward study, by I work, have a family, etc. so I’m definitely not putting in hours-per-day on the regular. I try to hit 20 new cards per day on JPDB, mix in some Bunpro grammar, read a little, listen to some Teppei when I’m driving or whatever. Currently working through N4 lessons. As a result of self-studying, my input comprehension is increasing, while my output is lagging significantly. 

    Just patiently plodding along.

20. I’ve been learning for 3-4 years on and off. I can’t form a sentence or “speak” Japanese, but I can easily understand 99% of media with the occasional lookups, mainly when I read light novels. Everyone’s goal is different at the end. I don’t really care to go to Japan or converse in the language I just wanted to turn off subtitles 😂

    I feel like I’m in an okay place with it . One thing that helped me a lot was when I didn’t feel like doing Anki or “studying”, I would just watch a few anime episodes or read a few manga chapters.

21. 22 years and going.

22. I’ve lived in japan 2 years, I’ve met people who have lived here 10 + years and can’t speak a word. 

    Especially inaka areas with lots of Thai, Filipinos, Vietnamese etc.  similar to Canada you get small communities of immigrants who never use the native language. 

    Imo it is impossible to reach “fluency” by yourself.  You basically need help, or someone to talk with. 

    This pretty much means it is impossible for lazy learners to become fluent 

23. I would compare language learning to learning a musical instrument or maybe even bodybuilding.

    You can learn a few sentences or a few songs, or build a few muscles in a couple of months. It’s like a party trick. But real fluency, professional musical ability, or movie-star level muscles usually take years to develop.

24. Me with my nearly four years and only N4 💀 But I’m taking college classes now so hopefully it’ll accelerate my studies much more

25. A 4 year degree only gets you to n3 so your doing well

26. Understanding and fluency came in different stages.

    Four years in, I was able to understand spoken Japanese explanations of grammar and vocabulary, so I could choose a Japanese explanation on YouTube rather than looking for an English speaker to explain whatever Japanese I needed help with.

    About six years in, I had an opportunity to go to Japan, and it turned out I could handle myself with no English, no gesturing, no dictionary, and no sleep. Just Japanese speech. Mind you, I didn’t have Japanese conversations regularly leading up to this, but for the most part, I didn’t need people to repeat themselves, not did they feel the need to ask me to repeat myself.

    Ten years later and after being more consistent with Japanese media consumption upon coming back from Japan, I still need help if I intend to understand every little thing (refer to my リング 完全版 transcription help requests on the Daily Thread), but to put this into perspective, those were about seven lines out of a movie with 1,031 lines of dialogue. Now, if I were just “rolling with the punches” and not trying to nitpick everything I hear, I can understand more or less anything if I’m actually interested and not zoning out, and I can express most things as well as I can in English, though my writing is far more eloquent than my speaking. With that said, I obviously still have a higher level to strive for.

27. Come on, 3 years and N3 is nowhere near “lazy”. I’ve “studied” for maybe 7 years now, sometimes taking 6 months gaps not studying at all due to exams/health issues/other hobbies/life, and I’ve only just managed to be around N4. I’ve studied around 1-2 hours a day for 1-2 months after much effort now which is what I thought was non-lazy, so hearing you consider that lazy is just… thanks I guess?

    Some of us have other stuff in our lives than Japanese. Chronic illness, for example. Or spending another 2 hours a day learning machine learning because life fucked you over so you have to change career paths. Etc.

    I just study Japanese for *fun*, and I’m tired of feeling like I need to be faster in every damn area of my life. What’s the point of being fast? I’m not trying to reach some arbitrary goal, I just wanna have fun learning.

28. Once I have the full data for november I’ll make a post about my journey in japanese so far. Hope it’s interesting for the average Joe because I’m severely mentally impaired. 

    I think the most common “I’m learning a language” (as a hobby) worldwide is 2-3 hours a week so… Yeah. Don’t stress

29. Honestly, i have so much going on, kids, work, fitness, that i barely study 15 min a day.

30. >little over 3 years now, and I’m around the N3 level

    nah you good

31. 5 years, basically no studying besides 1 year of class in the beggining.

    Used Wanikani for like 4 months.

    No flash cards, no duolingo or any other app besides the one I used for 2 weeks to learn Kana.

    Lived 2 years in Japan “focusing on immersion” (going to bars and talking with people).

    Im at N2 level when it comes to fluency. N4 when I have to write by hand without looking up kanji.

32. I am not lazy, i just found a comfortable tempo and a way to do it.

    I feel the improvement and the consistency, and that is all what matters to me.

    Been learning it for 5 or sth years, so… I am very aware of the mistakes I did in my journey.

33. I’m very lazy. Been learning Japanese on and off for years. Not even out of N5. I’d be a lot more active in learning it if I didn’t have other commitments. 😅

34. 10 years for N2, another 5 years for decent fluent conversations on nontrivial topics

35. N3 in 3 years? That’s kind of insane in my books lol

36. So, I’ve been surrounded by Japanese stuff for…over ten years, I want to say, probably closer to 15, and only recently have I started taking my study of the language remotely seriously. I tried in the 2010s to work out how to get anywhere but couldn’t make any headway. It wasn’t until the COVID pandemic that I eventually started seeing ways forward when I picked up ‘Minna no Nihongo’.

    Unfortunately, I dropped it about halfway through the first book, because my focus was just not there. Same for ‘Genki’; I got far in the first book, but stopped paying attention to it. However, at the start of 2023, I picked up WaniKani and haven’t missed a day of it so far; even if I only do a handful of reviews in a day because of other things, it’s still something.

    My entire time learning so far can be distilled as trying to find something instead of simply doing. I’ve at least found something I can use for vocab, and I’ve been able to start reading things and parsing it, even if the grammar side of things is really shaky right now. I do have a couple other books that I will go through from the start of next year, so hopefully those help.

37. I needed to read these comments. I’m just in N4 territory after 18 or so months and this board makes me feel like a dunce.

38. I don’t have much insight to add and I wouldn’t consider myself fluent. But if you reached N3 in 3 years you’re WAY above the average pace. I’ve been studying Japanese for all my adult life and actually majored in Translation Studies in Japanese and I doubt my Japanese is much better than yours.

39. I am learning for 5-6 years and only now reached N3. So everyone upgrades on their own abilities and my language learning ability isn’t great. But I still try to do most of my reviews everyday and do night school once per week, but that’s it. Hardly any immersion, but since o have no direct plans when I will visit Japan I only do it for fun.

40. On the same boat, 3 years in and at a similar level.
    I know I will never reach fluency. I study Japanese for fun. Fluency is not my goal- learning is.

    People love to toss the word fluency around without acknowledging what it actually means. True fluency means not thinking about the rules and grammar of a language at all when interacting with it. It means naturally knowing when to break those rules in order to convey certain ideas. Thinking, dreaming, speaking, listening, and reading in a language. Lightning-fast code switching in the brain. Unless you live in Japan or intensely engage with the Japanese language fluency is very unlikely.

    Not becoming fluent should not stop you from practicing Japanese. Keep learning, note your progress and most importantly, have fun! I am loads better now than I was a year ago, and I know that next year I will say the same thing about this year. Enjoy the journey

41. I imagine it’ll take several years for me. Juggling between learning japanese while doing an MBA program is quite challenging lol MBA comes first of course, so most of the time, my japanese textbook is on the backburner collecting cobwebs

42. If it took you three years to reach N3, then expect another 3 years to reach N2 and another 6 years to reach N1 (assuming you study about the same amount of time daily as you have in the previous years.)

    Why? The amount of material doubles from level to level.

    Now – since you are getting better, and reading novels and manga and watching NHK news becomes a more and more enjoyable experience, you will be able to get there significantly faster. And don’t worry: everyone’s journey really is different! Enjoy the trip! I myself am in my 6th year, reading novels and short stories (Murakami, Yoko Ogawa, Keigo Higashino) and having the time of my life. I don’t worry about levels, but my guess would be somewhere between N3 and N2.

    DISCLAIMER: Even N1 is not “advanced”, let alone fluent from a native Japanese speaker and newspaper reader.