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by AutoModerator
1 comment
u/Sol_Atomizer
wrote:
>I recently watched this video
>[https://youtu.be/N9nd7EZ9nOA?si=Q_rayeDgblDFwRsR](https://youtu.be/N9nd7EZ9nOA?si=Q_rayeDgblDFwRsR)
>And he makes a really interesting point
>
A good example of why these “basic” patterns are not simple at all can be seen in giving/receiving constructions like:
* ～てもらう
At first, this is often introduced as something like “to have someone do something for you.” But in reality, its behavior overlaps with multiple major grammatical systems.
For instance, ～てもらう can sometimes express a meaning very similar to the passive.
* 先生にほめてもらった
* 先生にほめられた
In cases like this, both can convey a sense of receiving a benefit.
However, this correspondence is limited. When the situation involves actively requesting or arranging an action, the passive becomes unacceptable:
* 先生に手伝ってもらった
* 先生に手伝われた (×)
So the overlap is partial, not general.
At the same time, ～てもらう can also overlap with causative expressions:
* 息子に切手を買ってきてもらった
* 息子に切手を買ってこさせた
But again, this is not a simple equivalence. In situations where the speaker cannot legitimately “direct” the other person (for example, when the other person is of higher status), the causative becomes inappropriate:
* 先生にレポートを直してもらった
* 先生にレポートを直させた (×)
So here, social relations and politeness directly affect grammatical choice.
And this is still only the beginning.
* Case marking is not fixed (the beneficiary is not always marked with に; sometimes を appears)「道に迷っていた人を助けてあげた」
* It can be used to prompt or induce action 「君には今度アメリカ出張に行ってもらうよ」
* It can refer to past events without any active “request” involved 「小学校３年のときに、山本先生に教えてもらった」
* There are systematic variations in politeness (やる / あげる / くださる / いただく, etc.)
* There are even uses that are not strictly “benefactive” (e.g. 思い知らせてやる)
So what looks like a single “grammar point” is actually a point of intersection for:
* passive
* causative
* modality
* social hierarchy
* discourse perspective
In other words, it reflects the broader structure of the language.
This is why it is misleading to approach Japanese as a sequence of isolated grammar points that you can “look up one by one” online and then move on.
**You are not learning independent items.**
**You are gradually entering a system where everything connects.**
And that is precisely why something that looks simple at the beginning turns out to be anything but simple later on.
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